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Raven67854 wrote:I dunno just make a simple text RPG or something. Or maybe make a simple 2d game of pong.

This is how you start programming, not specifically how you start using a "drag'n'drop" game engine. Just start by making small practice areas in Eclipse. Work on your mapping skills, submit them for review, and let people who are proficient in Eclipse tell you what you need to work on.

You also need a design document. This is probably why you have a feeling of panic about starting a game. You are beginning work when you have no idea of which direction you are heading, which is a very bad idea. You may get halfway through development and realize that you need to make massive changes because of something that came up later.

If you work on your Eclipse skills, and create a large design doc that covers everything that the game will include (every zone, item, class, spell, monster, boss, etc.), you will feel much more comfortable about beginning. You cannot just sit down and start writing a game and make it up as you go. That is asking for trouble.

At the end of the day, if you started by making a 2D pong game or a text-based RPG, you would have some basic coding skills, but you would not really be any closer to being proficient with Eclipse.

well i think hes kinda getting at that when...."you start programming by making random shit" just so he can get used to the different aspects and the like. Im going through some programming books my self, one of the first things i did in java was how to add up football scores...it has no use to me for my MMO but i still understand the language better.

Jesusfreak just needs to sit down with a book, unattach his internet, and finish the book. then come back here and start using what ever program he likes.

Jackolantern wrote:

Raven67854 wrote:I dunno just make a simple text RPG or something. Or maybe make a simple 2d game of pong.

This is how you start programming, not specifically how you start using a "drag'n'drop" game engine. Just start by making small practice areas in Eclipse. Work on your mapping skills, submit them for review, and let people who are proficient in Eclipse tell you what you need to work on.

You also need a design document. This is probably why you have a feeling of panic about starting a game. You are beginning work when you have no idea of which direction you are heading, which is a very bad idea. You may get halfway through development and realize that you need to make massive changes because of something that came up later.

If you work on your Eclipse skills, and create a large design doc that covers everything that the game will include (every zone, item, class, spell, monster, boss, etc.), you will feel much more comfortable about beginning. You cannot just sit down and start writing a game and make it up as you go. That is asking for trouble.

At the end of the day, if you started by making a 2D pong game or a text-based RPG, you would have some basic coding skills, but you would not really be any closer to being proficient with Eclipse.

Actually at that point he was just asking what could he do outside of Eclipse. He had basically given up completely on eclipse. Also nothing you mentioned would of aided him at all with learning to program using eclipse as his engine. It would of taught him how to make maps with Eclipse. Far as making a GDD while that is VERY useful for large games like an MMO. I don't think he needs to really be tackling an MMO at this point. He choose game maker to get started off with learning to make games and so far its going really well . I personally don't think anybody new to the world of game development should try making an MMO. Even a 2d MMO yes there are the occasionally teams who do make it and do really well. But for the most part they just burn out and die. However maybe one day the entire community can play his game however for now he should learn the basics.

Raven67854 wrote:

Jackolantern wrote:

Raven67854 wrote:I dunno just make a simple text RPG or something. Or maybe make a simple 2d game of pong.

This is how you start programming, not specifically how you start using a "drag'n'drop" game engine. Just start by making small practice areas in Eclipse. Work on your mapping skills, submit them for review, and let people who are proficient in Eclipse tell you what you need to work on.

You also need a design document. This is probably why you have a feeling of panic about starting a game. You are beginning work when you have no idea of which direction you are heading, which is a very bad idea. You may get halfway through development and realize that you need to make massive changes because of something that came up later.

If you work on your Eclipse skills, and create a large design doc that covers everything that the game will include (every zone, item, class, spell, monster, boss, etc.), you will feel much more comfortable about beginning. You cannot just sit down and start writing a game and make it up as you go. That is asking for trouble.

At the end of the day, if you started by making a 2D pong game or a text-based RPG, you would have some basic coding skills, but you would not really be any closer to being proficient with Eclipse.

Actually at that point he was just asking what could he do outside of Eclipse. He had basically given up completely on eclipse.

I didn't catch the part where he asked what to do outside of Eclipse. The thread was getting a bit long, so I just assumed the situation was still the same as from the OP.

Raven67854 wrote:Also nothing you mentioned would of aided him at all with learning to program using eclipse as his engine. It would of taught him how to make maps with Eclipse.

Mapping was only an example. I just meant to use the program to make small bits and pieces to learn more about it, instead of trying to tackle a large MMO right from the start with Eclipse. Using Eclipse is not "programming" unless you want to write sadscript or alter the source code in VB6. I admit, I did not make it clear that I meant "mapping and other things" in my post, which I thought I did until I went back over it. If you want to learn how to use Eclipse, the best advice is to work in Eclipse on small projects. However, if he is not interested in using Eclipse anymore, there are so many other options out there, it is hard to narrow them down.

EDIT: If I recall correctly, there is a good set of tutorials for Game Maker that start with "Catch the Clown" and work up slowly through more advanced games. That is the best internet-based route for Game Maker, or if he really wants to get down to business, The Game Maker's Apprentice is considered to be the most complete and highest rated book available for GM. I personally prefer books, because it can be hard to piece things together between online tutorials by different authors.

and I think we have all ran into the issue with reading one tutorial, then moving on to another and having to go through the same crap again to get to the good stuff, then moving to the next and having to once again read through the same garbage to find the new material.

Game maker is a great start as is a game like catch the clown or something simple, THEN start adding your own elements to it. Won't be long you will be problem solving so much that the language will be second nature.

Does Game Maker include a proper scripting language, or are all the complex GM games made by really creative use of the action icons and conditions?

It has a scripting language called GML(game maker language). Least that is what I believe what its called .

yeah its not a bad scripting language. Its syntax is much like PHP or JS.

I wouldn't just say to practice...I mean, practice toward what? If you've no clear idea of what, you'd be practicing toward something random. Or if it's practice toward something 'good', well, who's idea of good? If you make a game that's someone elses idea of good, well, you haven't made your own game, you've made someone elses game. That's not indie.

What I say is go back to what you find fun, and make your own game of it, no matter how it turns out. If you like quake live, or dragon age, make a game of it (and make it a short game to begin with). Even if your game turns out to be pong or space invaders. Just try - if you try there will atleast be some thin, tiny vein of what you find fun and cool about those games, but now it'll be in your own game, something you made.

The hard thing might be realising you've put so much effort into learning code and your only getting that thin vein when all around there seem to be awesome games abounding. But just remember that the commercial ones had a ton of guys paid full time. And even the indie ones usually have a team as well. Alot of good games do very well at hiding exactly how much money and skilled man hours were put into them. Indeed the more skilled man hours put into them, the more they hide how many of those hours were put in. Which leaves you thinking you aught to be making something that matches these things, which isn't fair on yourself.

This thread is 8 months old. I don't think the OP is still even around the forums anymore.